tv The Cycle MSNBC January 17, 2013 12:00pm-1:00pm PST
children and adolescents in particular may be at an increased risk of seizures, confusion or abnormal behavior. the most common side effects are mild to moderate nausea and vomiting. the flu comes on fast, so ask your doctor about tamiflu. prescription for flu. i'm krystal ball. i did not see this coming.
manti te'o's dead girlfriend was never alive. college football story of hope is a hoax. there's so much to tackle here. get it? football. tackle. yeah, i know sports. i'm steve kornacki. what's the name of the movie where the washed up producer creates a synthetic woman and then the world finds out she is not real? oh, oh. simone! this is just like that. isn't it, s.e.? >> i have no idea but manti te'o, i have some questions, like, what is an online relationship and be specific. >> i'm toree. manti's the talk of the nfl. will this hurt the draft chances? will he be forced to become a jet? we don't want you! it's thursday, so obviously i'm starting with sports and this is no sports metaphor,
folks. it's a real story that rocked the sports world and developing minute by minute. bear with me because this thing is kree si. there's this football player named manti te'o. >> yep. that's true. >> that's true. a star for notre dame. >> true. >> yep. >> famous university and during the final college season the team is on the way to a national championship. >> sort of. >> he is a candidate for the heisman award. >> that's real. >> early in the season, we learned that he's playing with a heavy heart. >> why? >> suffering two enormous tragedies back to back. >> what? >> death of his grandmother and the death of his girlfriend. >> not real. >> no. >> a girlfriend that was in a car accident. >> no, she wasn't. >> stricken with leukemia. >> no. >> she is an inspiration to him. he laid in the bed hours for end and slept with the phone on while she was sick. >> no, no. >> no. >> any never. >> magazines devote pages to it. tv shows, thankfully not ours, run segments about it. and it never actually happened. >> what? >> she doesn't exist.
>> what? >> no. >> tip of the hat here to deadspin.com for exhaustive reporting and now notre dame and manti te'o saying he was duped. >> what? >> huh? >> stop. >> this was a very elaborate, very sophisticated hoax perpetrated for reasons we can't fully understand but had a certain cruelty at its core. that the single most trusting human being i have ever met will never be able to trust in the same way again in his life. that's an incredible tragedy. >> but many questions remain. >> yep. >> did he find out? why are the dates all garbled? he and the family said they met in real life. >> no. >> he knows the alleged perpetrator behind the hoax. that's weird. >> what? >> only continues to get weirder after that. formerly deleted twitter accounts of those involved come back to hurt.
>> my head hurts. >> an arizona cardinals fullback said he met this girl. >> no! >> actually really a guy. prankster. i don't know. >> oh! >> joining us is tom skoca managing editor of deadspin.com. do we have everything right there and has anything changed since deadspin first reported this crazy story? >> well, some of those things are hinges that have changed in the time since but that's pret -- much it, i think. there's belief that people hopped on the twitter handles and the dead people that never existed tweeting again. >> coming back? >> yeah. >> okay. one thing that this is raised is a question for me is, it actually brought to my consciousness things that i didn't know about notre dame's football program, such as that there were two young women, one who was sexually assaulted and then committed suicide, sexually assaulted bay football player on the team. >> right. >> allegedly and then committed suicide. really, no investigation in to
that. another young woman who alle allegedly raped by a football player and then bullied by the team in to not reporting that. a videographer. who was killed by what seemed to be somewhat negligent behavior. is this going to bring to light a lot of things about this football program and really change the way people view it overall? >> i don't know how much more could be brought to light about notre dame but notre dame has always been an incredibly image conscious football program and it's always employed some myth making to make that image. you know? going all the way back to newt rockney and george gipp and the fictitious or apparently fictitious story of george gipp asking the team to win one for the gipper. there's a history of notre dame trying to present the program as larger than life and more noble than life and seems to be a particularly spectacular
instance of the mythology out matching the facts. >> i think it's also a spectacular instance of negligence on the part of the media. you folks excluded. a lot of folks in the media, venerable institutions, reporting this story as it was -- as if it were true taking completely as fact a lot of assertions made by manti te'o himself and other folks around him. and, i'm just wondering, you know, if i'm an editor and i have been in that position before and i hear this amazing story of manti te'o and his beautiful stanford girlfriend, i mean, i'm dispatching a reporter to stanford right away to meet this girl, get her on camera, talk to her. why did that never happen? >> that's one of the great mysteries. i think a lot of it has to do with how thin the resources really are. when we first got this tip that she had never existed, it seemed completely unbelievable because
it had been so widely covered and reported. >> right. >> one of the first things is reporting coming in and we kept not finding her was to go back to some of the coverage, especially the big "sports illustrated" profile of manti te'o and looking for the things that we would have to disprove. look at the story and say, well, what do we know about her and what would it take to prove it false? when you looked at it, they didn't know anything about her. te'o and his father told them things about her but, yes, they hadn't talked to her family. they hadn't found anyone to her funeral and sort of bring her to life and i think that testifies to the shallowness behind a lot of these human interest stories tacked on to sports. it is sad face you type at the beginning of the story but you don't care about it enough to go report out the humanity of manti te'o's girlfriend because if you did you would find out there wasn't. >> right. >> i mean, you write, tom, an
incredibly compelling story as it was presented to the public for the better part of the last year and public seems to eat stories like this up. i guess i'm looking at this and trying to piece together and trying to figure out if there's a scenario here where whatever the truth is, this was not all just one long e lap rattly hatched plot on manti te'o's part. maybe there was -- you know, maybe this is a situation where, you know, he met somebody online. he developed what he thought was a real genuine relationship with somebody online. i think that can happen in this day and age. and then, you know, how do you explain that to somebody? you try to explain, i met this girl. means everything to me. blah, blah, blah. the natural question from anybody, well, you know, you have met her, what's she like? i have never met her. maybe lies kind of grow out of that. maybe it was a hoax, somebody that knew who he was, took advantage of the trusting nature. is there a way to piece this together where, yeah, this is
blown up right now and not all just some really cynical ploy on the part to get sympathy and increase the heisman chances? >> that's the thing we're still trying to figure out about this. notre dame and te'o himself with stories presented as strictly victimization by someone else that he was an innocent all along. albeit an innocent who found it out still hadn't managed to tell anyone in the world outside notre dame before the story we had came out. but if he and notre dame were victims, they were victims who did very well by the story. for a few months. i mean, it turned him in to a stand-out national figure. he's a great football player and a linebacker, hard to get that much attention as a linebacker. you know? notre dame had an undefeated season until the national championship game but no one knew for sure they were going to
do that and a lot of enthusiasm that gathered around notre dame had to do with the fantastic story so, you know, there have been people victimed worse in the world than that. one question simply is whether it started off as somebody pranking him and then he figured it out and then decided to stick with it. the whole situation so far outside of what you normally expect to see happen that it's hard to make guesses about what the probable scenarios are. a lot of people we were talking to, reporters, were hearing that it was sort of a hybrid scenario, that their best guess was that it started as a prank and then he ran with it and found that it was a prank he didn't stop. >> tom, yeah, this is one of the weirder stories in modern celebrity and modern sports. i'm really -- i want to dig in deeper. you talked about what other people thought. what do you think? do you think that as you're
saying this started as a hoax where somebody was teasing him and then he found out and rolled with it or kind of knew? i mean, people from notre dame have said, the guy's an attention hog and kind of saw, like, maybe there's a potential to help myself in a heisman race or get more attention nationally. what do you think is at the basis of this from his perspective? >> i see -- what i see in it, i think that, you know, the scenario that steve laid out about how it -- it might have just been covering up and telling elaborate lies because he's a regular guy caught in a weird online relationship and doesn't want to admit it's only online but there's a lot of detail attached to this story and a lot of claims about them meeting and just claims about the depth of love between them. claims about how long they've known each other, the story of the eyes meeting after a stanford-notre dame football game. >> right. >> and most of the stuff seems
to source back to te'o or te'o's family in the conversations with the press as he became such a notable public figure. >> right. >> and so, it's hard to really think that this degree of elaboration was just the result of some terrible puppet master pulling his strings. >> right. well, interesting story. kudos to your outlet for breaking it but i think of pinnochio and it's plain as the nose on your face so thank you so much. >> thanks for having me. so, do you think manti te'o was innocent or in on it? resident sports expert segment producer nick wrote an article on our website asking if te'o is innocent or in on it.
derrick says, quote, i believe he was involved, not many people are that vulnerable. nnamdi says curious to see what this ghost girl looks like. join the conversation. and this story just gets stranger and stranger. we'll stay on top of it but next, we'll shift gears to another hot topic of the day. guns. matt miller says washington is missing the real issue and the consequences could be deadly. it's all ahead as "the cycle" rolls on for thursday, january 17th. (dog) larry,larry,larrryyy. why take exercise so seriously,when it can be fun? push-ups or sprints? what's wrong with fetch? or chase? let's do this larry! ooh, i got it, i got it! (narrator) the calorie-smart nutrition in beneful healthy weight...
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the senate starts taking up president obama's historic attempt to combat gun violence next week. major chunk of proposals deals with mental health. so today we're tackling mental health as a two-prong effort. first, policy angle. exactly when's in president obama's $155 million push for mental health efforts? and efforts of a top psychiatrist thinks might work. for the poll say part, "the washington post" columnist matt miller, latest piece is titled "how will we deal with the dangerously mental ill?" thank you for joining us. you talk about whitman that climbed up on the tower of university of texas austin and started firing shots and killing people and you talk about how in hindsight you could sort of -- you could trace it back to specific bio markers in his
brain. look at the brain in an autopsy and almost see what triggered that and you seem to indicate some hope that, you know, maybe future research identify more bio markers. seems optimistic to me. do you think that we can trace it down to something at level or a lot of people out there who there's no bio marker to say, hey, this person is prone to violence? >> yeah, i'm sure you're right. since i know "the cycle" is a hoax-free zone today, i'm a scientist so -- >> every day, by the way. every day hoax free zone. >> i got it. so now i'm intrigued by the work of a neuro scientist of david eagleman who used whitman as an example and actually in his suicide note for an autopsy to be done because he felt like something had gone wrong inside of him and lo and behold doing
the autopsy, they found a tumor the diameter of a nickel near the part of the brain that has to do with the regulation of aggression and fear. and so, neuro scientists are making the argument that a lot of what we view as quote/unquote evil actually has a biological source. the more we learn about and the more sophisticated the screening gets and the more sophisticated the science gets and there may be ways not only to identify hopefully in advance and treat folks who have these potentially very dangerous problems, but also, at least it also poses a real challenge for the criminal justice system because to the extent that what we think of as evil actually has to do with a kind of sickness or real mental disease. >> right. >> it changes the way we think about culpability and blame-worthiness. not excusing the horrific behavior but we have to protect
society. maybe without talking about blame and culpability in quite the same way. >> right. that's great. if neuroscience identifies the markers, that's a huge advance. the other end of it from a policy standpoint is president obama talking about more money for psychiatric services for specifically young people to try to figure out an early age prone to violent behavior. i guess my two questions about that, i wonder, first of all, is this going to necessitate a change in the law about doctor/patient confidentiality? if a red flag, you know, is raised, are we going to need to change the law so the doctor is able to alert the authorities and act on the information? flip side of that is if that's the case and the doctor's empowered to do that, do you think that might cause young people to clam up and not be as forthcoming as we need them to be? >> great questions, steve. i think the answer to the first thing is, yes.
you're seeing a proposal in colorado not getting enough attention on the mental health side and proposed a change in the legal standard where now doctors who previously were supposed to inform the authorities if there was some imminent risk to, you know, of harm to others, now will have a slightly, you know, a less stringent standard of substantial danger or substantial risk. in other words, something that is trying to encourage at the margin the medical profession or psychiatrist and psychologist to exercise judgment in a way to bring perhaps more things to light and have worries. but you are right. that is slippery slope. we don't want to discourage people from seeking help or find they're zig ma tized and a tough question for how society draws the line here. look at the mass shootings. you have very disturbed people from virginia tech to tucson to aurora and there had to be people around those people who
knew that these thoeks were on the edge and how we try and, you know, get that -- be able to act on that as a society without going down the road to the film "minority report" and locking people up in advance based on fof sys by seers, it's tough. >> matt, i agree with everything you're saying. and your article's careful to agree with what the president is proposing in terms of gun safety package, but talking about mental health illness is a sensitive issue. there were 5% of the violence in the united states can be attributed to people with mental illness. so, are we putting a little too much attention on this when they're committing a very small amount of violence and they find that drug and alcohol abuse is far more likely to result in violent behavior than having mental illness? >> look. there's no question that the president's focus and the
national focus on access to guns is the most important thing we can do to reduce the, you know, the outlier that the u.s. is in terms of gun violence compared to every other advanced nation. having said that, if you care about the mass tragedies which we have opposed to urban gun violence we see on the streets of chicago that the president is equally and rightly concerned about, it's hard not to look at an agenda for mental illness and i think what the governor in colorado is trying to promote on that side may point the way in a right direction. but also may be that there aren't full answers in a society to these problems but i think we got to try. >> i think an agenda for mental illness isn't just about preventing violence. it's also about better care for people who are mentally ill. you have a lot of republicans now who are talking about mental health and how that's the real issue that needs to be addressed. sort of as a way to get around having a conversation about
guns. but when these measures come up and when there's a price tag attached to them, are republicans actually going to be willing to support reform of our mental health system? >> the answer may be, no, to the extent it takes a lot more investment and even what the president proposes is small change. 25 million here and there for training for teachers, for training for local mental health professionals, so, you know, $3.5 trillion budget, this is all very small change and i think it's a fair question about whether republicans will even be willing to join in some of the stuff that we need to do there. >> you know, matt, i went to go back to something you raised, the issue of warning signs. and, you know, i got to be honest. i'm not against all gun laws. i think responsible gun owners just want those gun laws to be effective and i don't know that banning broad categories of guns is going to do the trick on this but there are some gun laws that
i think can work in tandem with mental health and one idea that i was talking to krystal about we came across and happens in new york city is, for example, in new york city to get a handgun permit, you have to get friend referrals, friends who recommend you for that responsibility. and it goes to mental health and that it gets around the loner idea. if you have to tell people you're looking to purchase a gun, and you're troubled, this gives you, you know, two or three opportunities for those check points and talks about that sense of community and societial responsibility again. what do you think? >> i like that. you know, i didn't know that was going on in new york. i read somewhere, i think maybe canada has something similar to that. >> i saw that, too. >> two or three recommendations. >> right. >> i think that's a great idea. of course, you know, it does -- it does mean you'll have to find out what your friends really think of you when push comes to shove and really trying to get a
gun. i have thought for the same reason or for a different reason these waiting periods, i always thought good ideas. the idea to come in and in the united states and there's still places to go in and say and look like you're angry at spouse and say i want a gun now seems to many crazy and, you know, the idea of a -- some kind of cooling off period plus some kind of, you know, friendly set of recommendations i think, why not? >> all right. matt miller, thank you for joining us. up next, tackling from a medical perspective. i've always had to keep my eye on her... but, i didn't always watch out for myself. with so much noise about health care... i tuned it all out. with unitedhealthcare, i get information that matters... my individual health profile. not random statistics.
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namely, the legislation requires mental health professionals to essentially disregard doctor/patient confidentiality and report patients they somehow deem to be dangerous to themselves or others. there's so many issues packed in to that. one, what counts as dangerous and depressive, postpartum depression in there? what's ptsd? how's this going to possibly be enforced? but steve alluded to this earlier. won't this deter people from seeking mental health help if they know that they have to disclose a lot of -- you know, this personal information and potentially be turned in to the authorities? >> well, i think there's that potential for that to occur but i think really the law in new york goes a step further saying that if somebody is dangerous, what prork is proposing, if a doctor feels that person is risk of harm to themselves or others,
doctors required to report this to the authorities. the authorities then run a check of that person's name against gun registry. and if that person owns a gun, then authorities could then go in and seize that gun. a lot of mental health professionals say potentially this deters people from seeking help but i don't really think that applies to the vast joo majority of people out there seeking treatment. the vast majority of people seeking treatment for mental illness don't pose a danger to themselves or society. i think that what the doctor or the mental health professional needs to keep in mind is we need to be thinking about whether these people sort of fit a profile. first of all, do they own guns? are they young men in general between the ages of 15 and 50? and do they have some sort of psychotic illness? people with the most severe mental health disorders about 1% of those are the ones who are at
greatest risk of going out and committing some sort of silent act. of course, you want to take in to consideration things like whether that person had a history of violence and whether that person is abusing alcohol and drugs so i think as long as people know that this is a small subset that's going to be looked at and then have their names passed on to the authorities, i don't think in general it's going to deter people from seeking help and talking with their doctors. >> well, i mean, when you put the profile out there like that to a layman like me, it's obvious. okay. sure. i have no degree in psychiatry but i might be concerned there. i'm just guessing but from sort of a clinician standpoint i would assume most are seeing people who are, i don't know, they're depressed in many cases. upset with where their life is and upset with people in their life and not necessarily sitting there saying, you know what? i just want to go shoot up a
post office or i want to go commit like a violent act but they're not in a good place mentally and how do you really kind of draw the line where, no, okay. they don't own a gun. maybe they could get one. not telling you they're taking alcohol and drugs but upset at life. how do you decide whether to turn somebody like that in? >> this is part of the training and being able to assess who poses a risk so i think that if somebody possesses those qualities that i talked about then you are going to have a greater likelihood of passing that information on. the problem really is that right now doctors' hands are tied so unless somebody is of imminent danger and this is really the keyword, imminent. unless somebody's telling you i'm about to commit a dangerous act either to myself or others your hands are really tied and one of the problems is even with the new york law i have, okay, so the doctor now can report this to the authorities, maybe guns seized but there's nothing in that law that then attaches
mental health treatment to this. >> right. >> so i think if somebody is ill enough we need to take the guns away from them, i think you have to assume that that person should be required to receive some type of mental health treatment. you are doing no good if all you do is take away the guns and don't mandate mental health treatment. people are then really going to have a distrust of mental health treatment. they're going to drop out of treatment if they're already in treatment and won't trust their doctor anymore. >> to that point, there's a heartbreaking "the new york times" magazine a while back of families with a member mentally ill and concerned that this person posed a threat to themselves and to others. but they were unable to meet that threshold of imminent danger and, of course, the mentally ill person did not want to seek help, did not want to be put in a facility. have we gone too far away from having long-term care facilities available for people who are mentally ill?
>> i think that there are two parts to that. yes, we don't have enough long-term care facilities. we don't have enough hospital beds for people but i think one thing that the president's proposal didn't address which i found really upsetting is it doesn't address the issue of imminent danger. i think those criteria need to be relaxed a little bit. i think the problem is vast majority of people with really, really severe mental illness unfortunately they think everything's fine with them. they don't recognize the fact that they need treatment. everybody else around them is crazy. so they're not going to voluntarily agree to go seek the help that they need. so, unfortunately, again, when you require imminent danger, oftentimes what happens is you recognize that this person of imminent danger after they've committed the violent act. >> exactly. >> that doesn't do anybody any good so if you can relax the standards enough, make sure that you're writing the laws such that you're not casting too wide of a net getting too many people
turned off from seeking help or talking openly to their doctor or mental health professional, you're specific but then you're allowing doctors to take the next step, getting them the help they need and allowing judges to mandate that people require -- who require the treatments get the treatments and that's also a factor of really needing the funding for mental health treatment. he was ause kated for outpatient treatment. he never followed up and nobody ever followed up on him. >> the mentally ill more likely to be victims than violent. are you concerned about the further stigmatization of people in this? >> absolutely. but i think that if we can talk about this and really make it clear that we're not talking about mental illness as a whole. we are not talking about the depressed mother or the person who's struggling with their marriage or something like that. we're really talking, again,
about a very specific small subset of people. we are talking about 1% of the severely mentally ill. so i'm hoping that will not happen where we cast too wide of a net and make people turned off from seeking help. >> doctor, thank you. >> thank you for having me. up next, countdown to inauguration day. barack obama made history as the first black president. could a woman be poised to do the same in 2016? even without hillary? that's next. [ male announcer ] when these come together,
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the boy's club inner circle, democrats may be on track to have an all-white male primary in 2016 if hillary did stay out. joining us is former new york city deputy public advocate and founder of girl who is code, an organization dedicated to equipping young women with the skills to pursue opportunities in tech and engineering and she is here to talk about a few women and didn't need the binder full of women. >> no. >> nice. >> i was looking at the fact in congress and in the senate, women more represented in the democratic party than in the republican party. >> right. >> but looking at who holds the governors' officers around the country, republicans are doing better than democratic and that's the traditional path to the presidency. are we doing something wrong in the democratic party to set women up to really be able to take that step and break that ultimate glass ceiling? >> look. i think we -- president obama
showed you don't have to be a governor to get to the president and we have a deep bench if hillary doesn't run and i pray that she does. look, some of the women with senator gillibrand, you know, talking about this a lot. stop saying that women aren't ready because we are and there is a deep, deep bench of women who are just waiting to lead. >> well, yeah, on that point, i would bet good money you won't have an all-white male democratic field in 2016 even if hillary didn't run. people around amy klobashar has ambitions. it seems to me there's a fundamental change here looking at the woman running for president before up until hillary in 2008, a lot of candidacies symbolic, sort of started and pulled back and now
i think it's a new era and standard on the democratic side and i believe the republican side, too. you can put kelly aotte's aim out there. one woman will be in the race for each open nomination and then multiple women. >> i think that's absolutely right. look. i think after 2012 we showed and demonstrated the power of women. we are the majority of voters. you know? women are simply, you know, they're chomping at the bit. sitting at the edge of the seats. they want to elect women. i see that here in my race in new york city and women are ready. when you see the debt crisis, we need more women in office and washington to simply get things right. >> we need more women in washington and in office. i totally agree with you. we won't end up, steve, with an all white male democratic primary. i want to see a female president. i want to caution against knowing what a mind will do because of the body attached to it. are we assuming that every woman
politician is great for woman? what an a woman anti-feminism, anti-choice, would we almost that? >> 2016! >> female equivalent of what clarence thomas is for black people? we won't want that. we want a politician good for women's issues as much as a woman to break that barrier. >> can i just say, poor joe biden? everyone is clamoring for hillary to win. he is the current vice president. and if she doesn't now, democrats are saying, who else can we find? i'd be like, i'm right here, people. look at me. can't catch a break. >> thank you for being with us. >> thank you. up next from the future of the presidency to white house history, you know kornacki is psyched. leading up to inauguration day, a new history channel series examines the most influential job in the world and the men who have had it. men so far.
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we got clients in today. [ male announcer ] save on ground shipping at fedex office. diarrhea, gas, bloating? yes! one phillips' colon health probiotic cap each day helps defend against these digestive issues... with three strains of good bacteria. [ phillips' lady ] live the regular life. phillips'. when washington was elected president, people didn't know what to call him. >> his title wasn't a frivolous issue. it was symbolic of the debate of the convention of the power in the presidency. >> john adams wanted it to be almost regal. his majesty, the president. >> washington settled on a more modest title, his excellence sy, the president. >> totally watching that. on monday, barack obama, president barack obama, will be sworn in for the second term as the 43rd president of the united states. a ground breaking presidency to say the least but no president
is as groundbreaking as george washington. when he became the first president, there was no precedent. every other president follow it is script by the man on the dollar bill. the history piece examines the evolving role of the presidency. joining us now, steve gillan. how are you? >> doing great. thanks for having me on. >> i'm fascinated how george washington shaped the presidency in to what we have now. talk a little bit about how george washington wrote the stript is that all other presidents follow. >> sure. i want to finish that story that your lead-in talked in about the title that washington would have and he wanted his excel len sy because he didn't want people touching him. instead of shaking the hand, they would bow so that's one of the reasons he liked it but washington really does -- you have to realize the presidency is an institution result of compromise and it's -- there are very few powers that are laid
out in the constitution and washington is the first of a series of presidents who takes that very loose language of what a president should be and defines it. he sets, you know, on monday president obama's going to take the inauguration. the constitution only says that the president take a 35-word oath of office. it was washington who began -- was the first one to give inaugural address, created a cabinet. all these institutions that we take for granted begin with washington and then they grow over time through a series of successive presidents and through events like world war i and world war ii. >> you know, steve, access to the president has really changed over time for much of the 19th century, the office was essentially open and people would line up outside and wait to meet with the president to ask him favors or get their appointments and, of course, that didn't change with lincoln. changed after garfield who was assassinated but the ranks have really closed around the
presidency, really hard to get to him. has that had an affect on the role of the president over the past century? >> that's a great question. first of all, the white house itself was open. up until the of world war ii in europe, people could have picnics on the white house lawn. >> right. >> before then people would stroll into the white house. the president would bump into someone at the white house. people would come and ask the president for jobs. after pearl harbor, that's when the security apparatus goes up around the president. but the other thing to mention is what we're using right now, the power of television. what he will vision has done is in one sense made it more intimate with the president but also created a certain distance as well. >> you know, steve, with he talk about george washington, abraham lincoln, i always put grant in the underappreciated category. there were a lot of clunkers in that time, too, the franklin
pierces and filmores. whatever you think of woodrow wilson's legacy, teddy roosevelt gave the office a lot of domestic definition and wilson foreign policy definition. could you talk about those two presidents and how they defined what we now think of as the job of the president. >> lincoln was a strong president who exerted executive power. what you have is the assumption was that congress would govern and every once in a while you'd have a strong president. andrew jackson or abraham lincoln. in the 20th century, teddy roosevelt changes that. at one point roosevelt is pushing through some piece of legislation and people were telling him he can't do it, and he gets out a copy of the constitution and he holds up article ii and he says show me
here why i can't do this. i think that become the assumption of presidents in the 20th century. if quur you're not specifically prevented from doing it, you can do it. wilson builds on the power of the president, the precedent that teddy roosevelt established. it's franklin roosevelt and the experience during world war ii that really changes the nature of the office and it's the cold war. the greatest expansion in presidential power throughout our history has taken place during times of war. what happens during the cold war is war is institutionalized. we live in a time of permanent war. it's the president's role as commander in chief that leads to not only the creation of this great apparatus around the executive, but also the expansion of power. this is the one elected person in our constitutional system and during a time of the threat of nuclear war, it's one person who
can make decisions. if you're looking at the key turning points, it begins with teddy roosevelt, wilson, franklin roosevelt and then the cold war forges what is now the modern presidency. >> steve, thank you very much. good luck with the special. >> thank you. up next, krystal goes invisible like manti te'o's girlfriend and goes behind enemy lines to give tips or republican as they vf have a strategy session. it was homemade. everyone tells a little white lie now and then. have a strategy session.he wants my recipe [ clears his throat ] [ softly ] she's right behind me isn't she? [ male announcer ] progresso. you gotta taste this soup.
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turning their party around. they've bravely faced the realities of changing demographics and are ready to find new ways of desperately grasping for power for their diverse coalition of old white guys and middle aged white guys. for example, this is the diverse panel of gentle maine assembled to guide the party. and if you thought 2012-style voter suppression and southern strategy was low, you ain't seen nothing yet. take this new scheme. think of it as voter suppression 2.0. republican legislatures in swing states across the country are planning on essentially gaming the electoral college. rather than winner take all, under their plan electoral votes would be awarded by congressional district. this may not sound to nefarious but it means the votes of urban voters would count for less than those of rural voters. if these measures had been in place in 2012, we would not be preparing for the inauguration
of president romney. rnc chairman reince priebus has already blessed the plan saying i think it's something that a lot of states that have been consistently blue that are fully controlled red ought to be looking at. reince you have really started something big here. of this williamsburg retreat is a great chance to explore some really game-changing ideas. let's see, what could you do? i know. ever since we gave women the right to vote it's been nothing but nag, nag, nag. todd akin and grill gingrey could lead a panel called the myth of the legitimate female voter. you can could strategize how how to put the vote back in the capable hands of men. mitt romney and jan brewer can lead a handle called olay, how to convince all latino